HC Deb 27 January 1846 vol 83 cc237-329
Robert Peel -
You cannot conduce more to the improvement of inferior soils than by encouraging the feeding and fattening of cattle, and thus permitting the application of the manure to the increased fertility of the soil. I propose, therefore, that one article of grain, which, I believe, may be applied to the fattening of cattle, shall hereafter be imported duty free; it is an article, however, of immense importance—I mean maize or Indian corn. I propose that the duty on maize shall hereafter and immediately be merely nominal. Now, Sir, I do not consider that by removing the duty on maize—I do not consider that I am depriving agriculture of any protection. Maize is generally used, I believe, in the United States; it is certainly used principally as human food, but its utility as human food is very much disregarded in this country. There are parts of the Continent in which it is made into most excellent food, and there are parts of the United States in which it is preferred to some of the food we use in this country; but I do believe that, by the free importation of maize, so far from doing a disservice to agriculture, by promoting the feeding of cattle an advantage rather than a disadvantage will be gained. -
We attempted to meet some of the objections which have been made to the varying price of wheat; at the same time to fix any duty which would be considered available would not answer the purpose which I am desirous to attain, of making an immediate reduction, on account of temporary exigencies, in the present amount of price. -
| WHEAT. | ||||
| Whenever the average price of Wheat, made up and published in the manner required by law, shall be for every quarter | ||||
| Under 48s. the duty shall be for every quarter | 10s. | 0d. | ||
| 48s. | 49s. | the duty shall be for every quarter | 9 | 0 |
| 49s. | 50s. | the duty shall be for every quarter | 8 | 0 |
| 50s. | 51s. | the duty shall be for every quarter | 7 | 0 |
| 51s. | 52s. | the duty shall be for every quarter | 6 | 0 |
| 52s. | 53s. | the duty shall be for every quarter | 5 | 0 |
| 53s.and upwards | the duty shall be for every quarter | 4 | 0 |
Henry Liddell -
Surely, in the same manner it might now be argued—at a time when the right hon. Baronet took credit for the success of his measures—that other causes might also have operated in producing that prosperous condition of the country in which he was sure they all rejoiced, and which he, for his own part, never remembered to have seen equalled; for he never recollected a period when wages were so high and prices so reasonable, or when the labourer enjoyed to such an extent the necessaries, he might almost say the luxuries of life, 293 as he did at the present time. Now, if the right hon. Baronet could show, in connexion with his own arguments, and in corroboration of the views he had taken of these matters, that the price of grain at this time showed any indication of a supervening scarcity, it would have certainly been a strong argument in favour of the opinions which he had brought forward.
He said that, taking the average of seven years previously, it was found that the price of wheat had been 56s. 8d. per quarter; that the average price of ten previous years had been 56s. 11d.; but that in the latter calculation was included that of the last three years in which corn had been higher in price than it was desirable to see it. And the right hon. Baronet concluded that, on the whole, the price ought to oscillate between 54s. and 58s.; that an average price between those two figures would be a reasonable average. Now, he (Mr. Liddell) had looked that day at the last Gazette, and he found that, for six weeks ending with the 15th day of January, 1846, the average price amounted to the precise sum of 56s. 8d.; and when the price of wheat was at this fair, reasonable, and just average—were they to be frightened by an apprehension of scarcity, from the maintenance of a system of protection under which all the best interests of the country continued to thrive?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Rous,_1st_Earl_of_Stradbroke
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Rous
Henry Rous -
When the potato crop failed in Ireland, and in parts of England when the destruction of the wheat crop was threatened, he was satisfied that something was necessary to be done for the salvation of the country. If the population of this country were increasing beyond calculation, while the area of land was limited, would it not be impossible to provide them with a necessary quantity of food if protection were not removed? He had heard something about 299 2,000,000 of acres being thrown out of cultivation in the event of free trade. ["More than that."] He had no fear of any such thing taking place, for he was well assured, and all the country Gentlemen must be aware, that so long as there was a labourer in the parish—and labourers there always would be—the land would never be left uncultivated.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Chetwynd-Talbot,_2nd_Earl_Talbot (father)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Chetwynd-Talbot,_18th_Earl_of_Shrewsbury
(aka) Viscont Ingestre -
The farmers were beginning to get some remuneration for their produce; the consumers had abundance of food, and labourers abundance of employment. Under such circumstances he could not see the necessity for proposing this great organic change.
He could not conceal from himself that with great energy and talent the right hon. Gentleman had governed this country; and he must ever gratefully remember the exertions which the right hon. Gentleman had used to stem the tide of revolution during the Reform agitation of 1831. The right hon. Baronet, in his speech the other evening, said he could not consent to be the pilot of the State vessel, unless perfectly unfettered. He applauded him for that. He (Lord Ingestre) had joined the ship's company, on the understanding that he was to follow that pilot; but believing that the landmarks and beacons had been removed, and that the ship was going in a false 303 course, he hoped he should not be accused of mutiny and sedition, if, having signed the articles for a different purpose, he declined being instrumental in weighing the anchor or hoisting the topsails to let the ship go down the stream of destruction. He could not avoid entering, at this early period, his protest against any diminution of protection to native industry.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Scott_(MP) -
At no former period since he had taken office were there higher wages for labour—was corn so steady in price, and so accessible to the poor. At no former period was there a greater degree of contentment; and this state of things was urged as a reason, not for continuing the course we had followed hitherto, but for abandoning that course. If the circumstances which produced the change in the mind of the right hon. Baronet were unable to convince his Colleagues, he (Mr. Scott) must question whether they would produce any change in the minds of hon. Members of that House. Abundance of corn grown in our own soil had, more than anything else, contributed to the welfare of the country.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sir_John_Tyrell,_2nd_Baronet -
He regretted the prolongation of the discussion, as it could not end in the House's coming to any conclusion upon that occasion; but he must say, as the right hon. Baronet had complained that his antagonists had not confined themselves to argument, but had employed vituperation, he felt, for one, as he imagined persons would have felt in the Peninsular war, if the Duke of Wellington and the greater part of his staff had gone over to Marshal Soult. Such was the feeling which he (Sir J. Tyrell), as an agricultural Member, felt at the situation he was placed in.
Looking, then, at all the proceedings of Ministers, he saw no reason why he should continue 309 to support what very fairly might be called the potato-Peel Government. When it was said that the great interests of the country were to be supported, he could not held regretting that it should have been thought necessary to introduce so important a speech as they had heard, with so much pompous preparation; and he confessed that he saw no reason for waiting a fortnight before he delivered his opinion with regard to the propositions of the Government. He could do it now as well as a fortnight hence. As for compromise, the measure might be a compromise with the Anti-Corn-Law-League, but certainly not with the agricultural interest of this country.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colonel_Sibthorp -
He had not the slightest hesitation in declaring that in his opinion the conduct of the right hon. Baronet, in delivering the speech which had fallen from him that evening, was such as to excite the disgust and indignation of the British public. He trusted that the English people would combine as one man in an effort to make the Prime Minister understand how odious to them were his proceedings. He would, at some future day, avail himself of a more fitting opportunity of expressing in detail his opinions on this subject. On the present occasion, he would not trespass at any length upon the attention of the House, but would sit down, contenting himself with this simple observation, that a greater insult—a grosser indignity—a more audacious mockery—had never been attempted to be put upon the House of Commons, even by the right hon. Baronet himself, than that which was conveyed by the whole tone, tenor, and matter of the hon. Baronet's speech that evening.
Earl of March -
With permission of the House he would read a few passages from that speech, that they might comprehend how startling, how amazing was the change which had recently been wrought in the mind of the hon. Gentleman on the subject of free trade. The noble Lord read as follows:—
He was not about to excuse himself for his vote upon that question. He then thought that the amount of protection was so excessive, that it could not be maintained; that the 23s. duty was more than could be maintained, because no foreign nation could pay it; but he frankly owned that in this he was mistaken, for he did not think that that protection was one bit larger than it ought to be, and he did think that there was this advantage in the present law, that it rallied round it many who would not have rallied round it if that protection had been larger, while no one could say that that protection was too large, looking at the burdens on agriculture; besides, it gave a greater stability and firmness to the law; and he did hope and he believed that there was among the people of this country, as there certainly was by Her Majesty's Ministers, a determination to uphold that law.So spoke the right hon. Gentleman on the 15th February, 1845; and the report assured the public that he resumed his seat amidst a storm of applause. He would be curious to know what demonstration of feeling was likely to await the hon. Gentleman if he were to go back to his constituents on the 15th February, 1846, and to describe to them the opinions which he now held upon the subject of free trade; most assuredly they would hear much that would be calculated to excite their amazement.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sidney_Herbert,_1st_Baron_Herbert_of_Lea =
The same opinions without reserve will be the passport with which I shall offer myself to the notice of my constituents; and I am further of opinion that when the question shall be regarded, as soon it will be, calmly and dispassionately, by many of those who take an interest, almost an exclusive interest, in agriculture, they will think that I have neither neglected my duty to them nor to the public at large by giving a hearty, a disinterested, and an honest 314 support to the measures now before the House.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_Howard_(Whig_politician) -
considering the circumstances of the country—considering, also, the success which had hitherto attended free-trade measures—he was prepared to give his assent to the Resolutions to be submitted to-night; and he would beg of the agriculturists to consider whether a measure of this kind, prepared by a strong Government, with the sanction of the Crown, could ever, in the long-run, be defeated.
He thought the period of three years too limited, and that the minimum of protection was rather scanty, for Mr. M'Culloch, the greatest of free-trade authorities, in his celebrated pamphlet or treatise on the Corn Laws argued on the supposition that a fiscal duty of 5s. the quarter might be retained.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sir_Edward_Grogan,_1st_Baronet
wished to put a question, as an Irish Member, to the right hon. Baronet the First Lord of the Treasury. The whole of the statement which the right hon. Baronet had made to-night was one of reductions; he, therefore, wished to know whether the right hon. Baronet would furnish a document containing a column showing the aggregate amount of these reductions, and another column setting forth the mode in which he proposed to make good the deficiency in the revenue which those reductions would occasion. Very considerable alarm existed throughout the country upon this point; and great apprehensions were entertained that the right hon. Baronet would be driven to a proposition for increasing the Income Tax. He was, therefore, anxious to know how the deficiency which would be created was to be made up.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Wakley
Why, it is because I am firmly persuaded that it is for the benefit of the millions of this country, that it is for the benefit of trade—that it is likely to conduce to the peace of the world—that it will promote and advance the social condition of the millions, and create new markets for their labour—that I, for one, am prepared at once, and without further hesitation, to say, (and I represent nearly 300,000 of the inhabitants of the northern part of this metropolis,) that I feel towards the entire proposal of the right hon. Baronet the strongest possible favour. I feel firmly persuded that no proposal was ever made in Parliament, as a whole, more conducive to the happiness of the people of this country, than that of the right hon. Baronet. But does the hon. Gentleman, the Member for Wiltshire, consider that the scheme is not calculated to improve the condition of the people? Why, is it not for reducing the price of bread? Is it not for reducing the price of meat? Is it not proposd with the hope of improving the condition of every family?
I wish them to recollect one little fact with reference to the constituencies of this country. Let them bear in mind, if they do excite the passions of the electors in the agricultural districts and of persons unconnected with agriculture—if their agitation shall extend, not only into the most remote parts of the kingdom, but also into the cities and towns, and shall influence there the feelings of persons who believe that they are dependent on what is called agricultural prosperity, I would beg of them to remember that there are hundreds of thousands of people in this country who are the consumers of food—not the sellers, and who have no votes at the elections. Now, I would wish to ask them if they are prepared to arrange every hustings in the kingdom as an an instrument of torture to the feelings of the poor man who has not a vote? I say, let them remember that they are about to make an appeal, in my opinion, of a most dangerous character, if it is to have any influence. For the poor man will say, "See what happens:—the parties who return the Members to the House of Commons, are the sellers of food, and we are the consumers of food—they have the votes, and we have none." Do you believe if an appeal of that kind is to be made, that it can do other than lead to a state of feeling of the utmost exasperation, and one, in my opinion, that is likely to be attended with the utmost danger to the peace of society, considering that the millions of this country are the parties who have no votes. They already complain of class legislation; they say that their interests are not protected in the Houses of Parliament; they say, that they have no voice in electing those who are to govern the country. They say, that they have been the victims of class legislation; and yet you are about to call upon the sellers of food to determine whether the consumers of food shall have justice done to them with regard to commercial legislation. I merely throw out these intimations now, because I am convinced, if the appeal be made to which I have referred, and if strong excitement be the product of that appeal, that it will be one of the most dangerous character, and will, in my opinion, threaten the peace of society. Now, Sir, if the hon. Gentlemen are sincere with reference to the feelings of the masses of the people on this question—if they really believe what they say—if they really do consider that the masses of society will be op- 321 posed to the scheme of the right hon. Baronet—I ask them, are they prepared to extend the suffrage to the working people—to those who are the main consumers of food in this country? No, Sir, they are not prepared so to extend the right of voting; and I say, under those circumstances, let them be cautious how they excite feelings of indignation on the part of the millions, and induce those millions to believe that they are, with reference to the legislation of this House, the victims of oppression. Believing as I do that the scheme of the right hon. Baronet has been propounded in a sincere desire to benefit the nation at large, without reference to particular classes or individuals, but for the benefit of all—believing that it is one of a just character; believing, in fact, that there is nothing of injustice in it to any party, I shall give it my most cordial support in every stage of the proceedings; and I am sure that if the right hon. Baronet maintains the noble and high ground which he has taken, the millions of the people will carry his proposition for him.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Gisborne_the_Younger
wished to offer a remark in reference to what had fallen from the hon. Member the Coroner for Westminster as to the Members of the Anti-Corn-Law League having received the explanation of the right hon. Baronet with solemn silence. [Mr. WAKLEY: Stubborn silence.] It might be stubborn; but on a subject of so complicated a nature, and involving such a vast number of subjects, it was scarcely possible to express an opinion without having some time allowed for deliberation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Newdigate_Newdegate
He could not, however, pass over an observation which had fallen from the hon. Member for Finsbury (Mr. Wakley). The hon. Member deprecated an appeal to the opinion of the country; but why, he would wish to know, did the hon. Member 323 apprehend dangerous agitation? On what ground did the hon. Member make his powerful appeal to the feelings of his countrymen against the danger of inflaming the passions of the working classes? Did the hon. Member know Gentlemen on that (the Ministerial) side of the House to be those who were accustomed to excite such angry feelings? Had the hon. Gentleman forgotten 1842? Had he forgotten that period when the yeomanry and gentlemen of England had been mainly instrumental in preserving the peace of the country, disturbed as it was by those who now supported the Anti-Corn-Law League? Had the hon. Member forgotten what he (Mr. Newdegate) had at that time stated out of that House, and for which he had been attacked in that House, and in another place, without notice and in his absence; but in support of which he had afterwards produced evidence, which had satisfied that House that the Anti-Corn-Law League had been implicated in exciting the people? Had he forgotten that it was the agricultural interests which had saved the country on that occasion from the consequences of the attempt thus made? As he was on his legs, and as the question had been mooted, he would take the opportunity of calling the attention of Her Majesty's Government to the circumstance that when the consequences of their present measure became apparent to the country, and when the property of the agriculturists was sacrificed by it, the Government might perchance not meet with that cordial support from the agricultural interests, when danger threatened, which they had hitherto received. Those who now furnished themselves the means of protecting the country might perchance no longer have the means of doing so; and they would also be taught to bear in mind, on future occasions, that the present measure of the Government had been mainly promoted by agitation. The right hon. Baronet had stated, that he had carefully prepared the mind of this country for the introduction of the measure of 1842; who, he would ask, if the country was prepared, had prepared the country for the measure of 1846; who, but the Anti-Corn-Law League? Was agitation, he would wish to know, to be employed against the agricultural interests alone?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orlando_Bridgeman,_3rd_Earl_of_Bradford
aka Viscont Newport
considered that those hon. Members who intended to support the policy enunciated by the right hon. Baronet to-night, contrary to their own conscientious convictions, and the actual or 326 implied pledges they had given to their constituents, would be guilty of a great dereliction of duty. With reference to one remark which had been made, he would observe that no other appeal than a constitutional appeal to the country was contemplated by those hon. Gentlemen who entertained similar opinions with himself. He must say that he did not think the right hon. Baronet was justified in bringing forward such a measure as he had propounded that night without appealing to the country and taking the sense of the constituencies on the question.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Aglionby_Aglionby
He believed that the Gentlemen connected with the Anti-Corn-Law League had, by reason and argument, made many converts to the same opinions, even among the county constituencies; and he believed that, a few years hence, the conduct of those Gentlemen would receive the approbation it so justly merited. The only objection he had to the efforts of the League was, that they had treated the question rather too much as a class question than as a general question. But, however that might be, they had done great service by enlightening the people of this country on the subject of protection. Had the right hon. Baronet treated the question as a class question, he should have felt bound to oppose his view of the case; but as the right hon. Baronet had treated it, he looked upon it as a great step made towards free trade; for which, as it affected the best interests of the country, he tendered the right hon. Baronet his most cordial thanks.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Bankes
He (Mr. Bankes) would ask, what provision was made in this scheme for maintaining the interests of the farmers in general; and, above all, of the little farmers of this kingdom? He could find nothing in it to that effect, or which appeared to have any such purpose. The compromise offered to these interests—to the tenant-farmers—was the consolidation of the highway rate, the payment to medical officers, and the provision for parochial schoolmasters; but what relief would that give to that class of persons? It had been said, that the support to the measure was not confined to the mercantile class, but was participated in by the landowners. Some of the great landowners certainly approved of it; but it was because they were great landowners, and would not suffer by the change; for, by the system of bailiffs, which was cheaper than that of tenants, they would be enabled to get their rents the same as usual. The tenant-farmers would in reality be the sufferers, because their whole class would, in all probability, be swept away by the measure of the right hon. Baronet.
They were asked yearly for an increase in the navy and the army, which they cordially supported, though such augmentation was not wanted for the purpose of protecting their fields, but for the protection of the Oregon, which was wanted not for the purposes of the agriculturist, but for those of the manufacturing interest.
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